Are you running into pain each time you have sex? Maybe something doesn’t feel right. Today’s guest, Dr. Ashley Zimmerman, wants you to know that sex shouldn’t hurt. In today’s episode, Ashley is sharing why our bodies hurt during sex, how we can determine the reason, and what to do to enjoy sex!
Review the Show Notes:
Sex Shouldn’t Hurt (1:42)
Common Causes of Pain During Sex (3:14)
Regulating Your Nervous System (16ish)
Education in Sex (19:37)
Understanding What Sex Actually Is ()
Learning How to Orgasm (28:24)
Body Parts (31:29)
Knowing Your Body (38:10)
Tips for Pinpointing Your Pain (46:33)
Becoming Comfortable in Her Sexual Self (50:05)
Advice to Younger Self (54:01)
Connect with Ashley:
drashleyzimmerman@gmail.com
Episode 008 of Someplace for Every Body
Review the Transcript:
Carly Someplace
Welcome to some place for everybody where we talk about belonging and being a human in our bodies in living in and learning to love our bodies. I’m your host Carly’s place. This podcast is brought to you by someplace images, boudoir for everybody. You can see the full show notes at some place for everybody.com. Now, let’s change some self perspectives.
Carly Someplace
Hi, y’all, it’s Carly, someplace that I’m so incredibly excited to bring back Dr. Ashley Zimmerman. Ashley, if you can introduce yourself with all of your lovely letters that go with your name.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Hi, everyone, I am a doctor physical therapy. I am also a birth and postpartum doula. A Pilates instructor and a pleasure coach. I’m just so cool. So So that’s me.
Carly Someplace
I’m so excited. So for reference, if you if y’all want to listen to it or haven’t before, I had Ashley on on Episode Eight of the podcast. And we kind of started talking about pleasure during that, and kind of dove deep into just the beginning aspects of what you teach in pleasure coaching. But today, we’re going to chat about sex, and we’re specifically going to chat about why sex should be pleasurable, I guess and why pain shouldn’t be happening during sex. I think it’s a pretty common thing, especially amongst women to be like, Oh, it’s supposed to hurt a little bit. And I and we’re gonna talk about it because it’s not supposed to.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Yeah, I mean, I think that’s just that’s it right? is there’s this thought that wherever it came from, probably from the time you were pretty young, because there’s, I think there’s a buildup around the first time you have sex, and I remember, like, my friends being like, oh, it’s gonna hurt to kind of like scared to even do it in the first place. And then if it does hurt, you know, there are things that that’s going to teach your body, right. And if it’s sore the first time, I mean, I think that sometimes Yeah, that that is going to happen. Now, if we had the education to have a partner that was supportive during that first time, or the education to do some self exploration before the first time. Something else is penetrating your vagina. I think that that would cut down on that worry and fear and the soreness during the first time you have sex, but I think just unfortunately, in this society, there is this narrative that like, sex for females is painful sometimes, but that you should just like, grin and Barrett
Carly Someplace
Barrett and be fine with it.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Yeah. Yeah.
Carly Someplace
So what are like what? Okay, so as a doctor of physical therapy, and we’ve talked about, we do talk about it in episode eight that we had you on, like pelvic health and wellness. So what is like one of the most common causes of pain during sex? Or are there common causes? Or is it just a variety and depends on the person or, like, tell me things?
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
I mean, okay, so of course, it’s gonna, like depend, everybody’s a little bit different, right? It’s never like exactly the same for any two people. But some of the biggest and most common causes for pain was sex is past trauma. And, yes, sexual trauma is part of that. But it can be any trauma. So it doesn’t have to be just sexual assault or any other kind of sexual trauma, any large traumatic event, or the small little traumas that add up all of those gets stored in your tissue. We, as vulva owners tend to have a lot of really important things in one small space in our blank pelvic bowl, and there’s a lot of tissue in that area, there’s a lot of fascia in that in the fascia, which is the connective tissue in between everything that kind of like holds everything together, that’s where our emotion and our memory is stored. So when you think like trauma, causing pain, with sex, it doesn’t necessarily have to be sexual. And I want to, like make sure that that, like, I really want to name that because people will say a lot. Well, like, how does that even like, affect me? Or like, I feel like I caused that or how can I couldn’t just like get over it. But if we don’t do anything to move it out of our tissue, it’s still gonna be there, if that makes sense. So you didn’t do anything to cause this as it isn’t your fault. Your body’s just really good at trying to protect you. Really, right? So it’s just going to
Carly Someplace
bring it specifically in tissue that close to you and associated with sexual organs.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Yeah, and then okay, so then just purely physically, you can have tightness in your pelvic floor muscles. And it it’s not like this, like lineated but if you see Give your pelvic floor in like three different layers. Think of the first layer as like the entrance around your vaginal opening. So it’s like circular, okay. And then if you think of the second layer just inside that opening, and then third layer is that deep to that, you can have tightness or restriction in any of those three layers. Oftentimes, like what people will describe when there’s tightness at the entrance is like an abrasion any are like a rubbing, burning, pinching sometimes. And then deeper, is where pinching will still be one of them. But it’s like a sharper, pokier pain that usually happens, like when it’s deeper back. Now, that’s just specifically talking about like the pelvic floor musculature. Okay. And then, I mean, when you think about I, I’m sure some of the listeners have been told that they have like a retroverted uterus or their uterus is pointed forward, there’s different positions that the uterus can be in. And there’s different positions that the cervix can be in. A lot of times they go together, sometimes they don’t, right? Because again, we’re not the same. And you could say,
Carly Someplace
nobody’s body is the same, we all have generally the same ish. Yes, hearts
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
are organized differently, and every one of us. So that can be tricky. And so that’s why also, if you are somebody who is having pain with intercourse, that’s why it’s really awesome that there are pelvic health therapists out there to help you figure this out. Because if there’s okay, this is an example, the deeper pain is often positional. So it’s really common for somebody to come in and say, I have deep pain. Sometimes they’ll even say it feels like they’re hitting something or it feels like they can’t go any further. Whether that’s a penis, or whatever, you’re inserting into the vaginal canal. Yeah, whatever it is, even like fingers, you know, they like anything that is inserted, they’ll feel like sometimes, like it gets stuck or just can’t like go any further. That’s usually like, what I’m going to be clued into check is like uterine position and cervix position. Okay? Because you because if you think about it, if your cervix is pointed a little bit more down, and whatever object is penetrating the vaginal canal, if it keeps hitting that if it’s pointed a little bit down, and it keeps hitting that cervix, like that’s not going to feel awesome, right now. So, yeah, so that’s some that’s like, that position is something to look at too. But then we have to also get into like, Okay, your cervix changes positions depending on where you are in your cycle. Okay, I do now. Yeah, and so so like when it’s gonna retract when you’re not fertile. Meaning like you’re when you’re not ovulating. So when you are fertile, like your cervix is going to like come down it’s like trying to get that sperm it’s like it wants to hang on and like suck it all in. Now that’s also going to change depending on what birth control you’re on if you’re on birth control. So like moral of this whole story is you are an individual and there are many different reasons why you could be having pain with sex but you deserve to know those reasons. And it doesn’t have to hurt
Carly Someplace
which I think is the the big point because I really do think that we are taught that like it’s gonna hurt and it’s okay if it hurts and like sure some if you’re in a slightly weird position once or twice and it’s like that didn’t feel comfortable type thing Sure. move and change position but I think that there’s a lot of power in taking aback being like okay, this hurts and it’s not, it’s not just like a hurt once and it’s done type thing. This is continuous hurt, or continuous pain or pain every single time you have sex not specifically, potentially just with like one partner that was maybe not in the right position or too big or too whatever or anything, or a specific toy that just doesn’t feel comfortable. Anytime you use it, but other toys do I think that that speaks volumes and I think that we’re just so conditioned to be told, it’s okay for it to hurt and it really shouldn’t be okay for it
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
to hurt, right? And I think you know, like when you if you Okay, so for anybody who’s like had a Pap smear, and after the Pap smear, you know, they’ll tell you sometimes like sometimes there’s a little bit of blood. Sometimes the cervix will look kind of like a strawberry. Strawberry has like the little like seeds on it. Yeah, and then so it’s like it’s like a little bit inflamed or can be right it’s not always and so like if you like poke the strawberry Read the flesh is pretty like thin. And it’s gonna you’re gonna like see the underside of the or like the inside of the strawberry skin like pretty easily, right? Yes, service kind of looks like that kind of like pulses like that. And so if you have a cervix that’s been irritated, it could be just what part of the cycle you’re on, right? So it could mean everything is totally fine, we just need to like, give your cervix a little extra care. But if your cervix is irritated, and it’s not mobile, right, so like if your uterus is pointed back or forward, or however, it’s going to prevent the cervix from being able to freely move as well. Got it. Okay. So if you have, for whatever reason, a cervix that’s been a little bit irritated, which could have been like from sex, it could have just been like, you know, weird position, and you’re like, Oh, weird. And then you notice little like pink because there’s a little bit of blood mixed in with the tissue, like, sometimes like, okay, that doesn’t necessarily mean there’s something wrong. However, if like you said, it continues, right. And every time you have penetration, you’re hitting your cervix, it’s irritated, but it can’t move out out of the way, because it should be mobile enough that like, depending on what position you’re in, the cervix should be able to move out of the way. Got it? Does that make sense? It’s just like having like a restricted like shoulder joint, right? Like your shoulder joint has 360 degree movement, while almost right, like you can like fling your arm around a lot. Your hip to like, there’s a big circumferential movement that can happen in those joints, right? If you don’t have, like, full hip range of motion going one direction, the rest of those ranges are probably going to suffer too. Yeah, either they’re going to like compensate and try to do more to make up for it. Or like the whole thing is going to kind of like start to freeze down.
Carly Someplace
Exactly that that makes sense with it. Like, if it’s not in the right spot, then it’s obviously going to hurt because your body does your body compensates your body tries to compensate.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Right, right. And if you you know when you think so, it’s really interesting. I just had a client who, for years who her uterus was shifted more towards the front of her body, so like towards her abdomen, okay, like towards the toward like towards the belly button. And her abdomen was super distended, meaning like, kind of like sticking out from like the uterine positioning. And obviously super uncomfortable. She kind of just felt like she’s bloated all the time. Like just never relief from the bloating, which is
Carly Someplace
awful, right? Fun, right?
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Hello, went through lots of things to help improve that. And she just had, it was kind of crazy. She just had an ultrasound, where they were looking to see because she also has had endometriosis. So they’re like looking to see if there’s any other endo tissue there, blah, blah. But the the practitioner who was doing it was an intra vaginal, I think she was intra vaginal. But I think they also had a scope on the top of the belly or something, I don’t know, there was like multiple things going on. And when the practitioner she just like hit the surface, not meaning to like hit it kind of like in a funny way. And the client wasn’t prepared, which if you’re like trying to look for stuff like that might happen, right. And her uterus immediately went back up to towards like the front door like towards her belly button. Because that’s its memory. Right? Got it. It learned in her body for so long that safety, quote, safety was to like shift forward and hug the front of her abdominal wall, which cause so many other things it like, catapulted her into all of these other symptoms that she was having, just because her uterus was kind of like adhered to the to the front of her stomach. Instead of being able to rest back and just that little twinge, made her uterus jump back into that memory of like, oh crap, no, we got to go here. Like I need to protect it. And then she like took a few deep breaths. realize she was safe, everything was fine. And the uterus kind of like fell back down. Wow, that wild?
Carly Someplace
That’s so wild. And it’s I think that’s like it’s mind blowing how much control and not control we have over our bodies at the same time. Because like you’re saying took a few deep breaths and is like, Oh, we’re okay. And like be able to like, move it back. Which is like, African superpower.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
I know. Right? And it’s that I think with every component so whether it’s from whether you’re having pain, with sex from trauma and like so your body is just guarded or if it’s like a physical muscular tightness, like your hamstring gets tight, you know your pelvic floor and get tight. Or if it’s because of cervical or uterine positioning or whatever the reason I think with each of those, there’s a component of perceived safety. Okay, and I think you I think that that’s something that isn’t talked about a lot. But just by understanding that, like, you’re going to feel your body is going to feel safest with you first. Yeah. Right. And so when we’re working on pain with sex, again, regardless of what is causing it, if there’s no perceived safety within yourself, whatever kind of therapy or help you’re getting probably isn’t going to go far. Right? Because your body’s going to immediately go back to that response of Absolutely not, we’re not doing anything, We’re retreating back to like our normal pattern. Right? And it’s, it’s more of a deregulation of your nervous system. Okay, you know, than it is about like, Oh, you’re, well, nobody’s broken, right? But there’s no, there’s very rarely like a mechanical, hardcore, you need surgery, you gotta like, do something about this.
Carly Someplace
Right? Right. There’s, I broke my wrist, and we can put a bar and a screw in it, and it’s gonna fix it.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Right? It’s a, okay, because like, she took a few deep breaths, she returned to like the safety within herself, she knew that the provider she was working with was safe, like she wasn’t in any danger. And she was able to like regulate her nervous system back down to like baseline to allow them to finish then the exam, were in somebody who hasn’t maybe done some of the work to get to where she’s at. Because if that would have happened, like in the very beginning of her journey, her uterus, first of all, wouldn’t have been down in the first place. Right, it would have been up in that position against her abdominal wall. But then if something like hit her cervix that she didn’t like, like, it would have like, held on even tighter. And so it’s about finding the pathways in our nervous system that support the ability for us to regulate them. versus staying in, we’re either going to be like in fight or freeze or flee, right, or run. And so we have to figure out and if for each of us, that’s different, we have to figure out how are we going to be able to regulate our nervous system back down to baseline so that we don’t have to go through that every time. Right?
Carly Someplace
Yeah, it makes sense. It’s fair. I mean, it’s important. So much, I mean, so much of what we talk about, just in general on the podcast is, is learning to have trust and confidence in ourselves and move forward in our own actions and how we, how we trust ourselves, there’s, there’s so much trust involved in, I don’t wanna say bodies and confidence, but bodies and confidence, like really like, each of us individually, in our own bodies, we have to learn how to trust ourselves, or, or we’re going to live in a state of fear, constantly. And that is, and you can see, you can see the differences in people who have trust in themselves and their body and other people who don’t, and it is, and I hate to categorize it into that, but it really is something that becomes, as I work more and more and more on myself, I can see through other people’s language through other people’s body language through all of these things, if they trust themselves, or if they don’t, and a lot of it, there’s so much that can come into that from obviously trauma, different situations, the way that you were raised where you were raised ethnic backgrounds different. There’s so much that comes into trusting ourselves and loving our bodies. And I will I don’t want to have a specific group but like, white, heterosexual sis normative men are like, very confident in their bodies, and everybody else is like, let’s figure it out for a second. And it’s like, I mean, it’s, it’s, it’s kind of a running joke that it’s like, if we can all just have the confidence of like, white men who think that they are all the things. Yes, in their bodies, and they they do they think that their bodies are perfect and wonderful, which is amazing, and a lesson that I wish we could all learn from them. But all the rest of us don’t quite feel that confident. And I won’t say like super super. Say that that’s what it is. But we all I mean, those are the people who generally are I don’t wanna say like acting cocky, but like, have that self confidence, err, and that like confidence in their body in general, that the rest of us kind of strive for.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Yeah, and clearly think about from the time that we’re born into this current world. We are taught about the white heterosexual male. Yeah, all of the normative values that we have, are for the white heterosexual male. And so they grow up in a society that really supports them. It teaches them about their body, it teaches them that pleasure is normal for their body, it teaches them that they are supposed to feel good in their body, and that they have agency over themselves, they are the only group that gets that from the time that they are born, they are the only group that gets that. And so when you look at everything that I’ve learned about sex has been like self taught. Yeah, you know, and I think that I think that there are strides being made, for sure. And I don’t want to discredit anybody who is doing that kind of work, because it’s, I think it’s getting better. But when you think about the world that they grow up in, and you think about the world that other people grew up in, it is night and day difference it is. And so unless you’re really dedicated to learning about your body, you’re not going to get the information that you need, but the information that you deserve, that’s just handed to them. You know,
Carly Someplace
that’s we so I drove home from a trip yesterday with my boyfriend for eight hours in the car. And we actually talked about, we were talking, one of the questions, we just like, went through this list of questions. And we were talking about, if you could take a million dollars and use it to better society in some way, what would you do? And both of us literally looked at each other and said, well, a million dollars isn’t enough for society. It is for potentially one community. And and so then we started talking about, like, what we would invest in, in a smaller community with a million dollars. And he answered that he would invest in income, like low income housing, or just affordable housing and being able to give, give people I mean, when we look at our basic needs as humans shelter, and I said, education, because I think that there’s so much in education that can change so many different things. And I think the biggest thing of that is teaching kids about their frickin bodies. Like just teaching them that there’s no way to have a right or wrong body is step one. And then moving on from there and being able to like have again, like, if I look back at sex education that I had in high school, it was so lacking, it was so lacking and it was just like, and like there’s such a part of me that’s like okay, cool, like do what you need to do to have these better conversations teach boys separate from girls don’t put don’t put middle school aged kids all in the same room who are just gonna giggle through the entire thing and not take it seriously. Yeah, separate people bring bring you know, just girls in and then just boys in or anybody who’s non binary can have their own class like these are things that need to be happening within schools and education. Because I don’t want to say we can’t rely on parents to do those things. There are some parents who are so good at parenting and are so sexually positive and our you know, use correct vernacular This is a vagina. This is a penis, you have a clitoris, you have you have a vulva? Yeah. Like, these are, these are terms. But a lot of parenting isn’t like that a lot of people want to soften these things. And again, and it’s you see this from one that most parents expect their children to just go into heteronormative relationships. That, you know, you’ll ask a toddler Oh, is this your girlfriend, but like, heaven forbid that they kiss a boy. They are a boy. And like, you know, whatever that is, taking a lot of that away. But then as kids begin to grow up and explore, I think that anatomy should start being taught when you’re like five in kindergarten, this is this is your body. And I think that in that I don’t want to say a sexual education starting at five. But truly, you know, if you’re a girl, people shouldn’t be allowed to touch you hear people shouldn’t be allowed to touch you in these places. If you’re a boy, one bodily autonomy, nobody should be allowed to touch you, unless you say so. Start with that with kids, right. And those are the type of things those that’s the type of education that I think would truly change the world, in how we perceive ourselves in how we move forward with every type of relationship and then how we move forward in the relationships with our bodies and that type of again, I feel like if I was raised in something like that, and was told these, this is how your body functions this is these are the parts that you have. And these are the things that quote unquote, should be normal for them. It shouldn’t be like oh here have a squirting orgasm every single time you have an orgasm. That is what porn teaches us and porn is not a teacher. Yeah,
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
yeah, you know, um, alright, so that Okay, so with like the education thing, I think it’s, people get really freaked out because they think there’s the huge false narrative around like, Okay, if you have, quote, sex education when they’re five, that means they’re gonna have sex when they’re five. But like, if you think of anatomy, anatomy is like learning about consonants and vowels. If you can know all about consonants and vowels, but know nothing about the English language, right? And once you start to get into English language, and speaking, there are so many different ways there are so many, like there’s fluid speak, and then there’s slang and then there’s like, formal and bah, bah, bah, all of it, right? There’s different ways. There’s parts of imprinting and typing and all of that, right. So well, you don’t start you don’t go to the end, you don’t go to reading a novel, a 600 page novel, you start with,
Carly Someplace
you don’t start with Warren Piece, you, you start with the ABCs.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
And that’s what it has to be like learning who is just so like, makes me so mad, that teaching a kid about their anatomy, you teach them you friggin thing, head, shoulders, knees and toes with them. You know, like, if we normalized their body, it wouldn’t have a stigma. If we talked about it, just like we talked about Head, shoulders, knees and toes. Right? It would just be that it would be their body parts. And if we taught them what bodily autonomy is, from the time that they were young, we wouldn’t have middle school age, mostly females, middle school age females or vulva owners, trying to figure out what is okay, touch and what is not. Right, because they already know what safety is in their body.
Carly Someplace
Yeah, absolutely. And I think I think that I mean, so much of this as we’re, if we’re gonna call it sex education, but like, that is the type of thing that then middle schoolers aren’t going to be potentially getting pregnant. And I mean, those are the type of things that teaching you your ABCs is giving you resources to read and write and teaching you anatomy is giving you resources to take control over your own body and know what happens with it. And I think that and that’s so that was my answer to the question is like, I would invest it in education, and specifically education about bodies, which starts with anatomy, and then goes from there. And I think that there’s, like you said, head, shoulders, knees and toes, like that’s a song we can all in our brains sing. And I’d be able to go from there and know, you know, whatever. And those are such big things and being able to, to learn from a space that about bodily autonomy and and being safe in our bodies, being safe in our bodies, and then knowing our bodies and saying this isn’t this doesn’t feel good, is a massive, massive leap forward in being able to, one reclaim our bodies for ourselves and to have the world and society set up for everybody knowing about their bodies, not just heteronormative white men.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Yeah, so you know, when I Okay, well, one point about the education thing that I just, I don’t know, currently how many women I have had, that I’ve worked with that don’t like you mentioned, like middle schoolers, like not getting pregnant. First of all, my high school had the highest pregnancy per capita in the nation, for like, a long time claim to fame. Jamestown, North Dakota. Um, there’s nothing. But anyways, besides the point, but, um, how many people don’t know that you only get pregnant when you’re ovulating? Yeah, that they don’t know. And they’re in their 30s. They’re in their 40s they have no idea how that works. And that is a failure of society. It’s not a failure of them. Because they weren’t provided with that basic information. Because it’s been made this like, big, scary thing. And I think, you know, if we had like, going back to like pain with sex and pain research that first time and talking about like, heteronormative and that’s what we’re, like, inundated with from the time that we’re born. Most people think that sex is penis and vagina penetration. The man comes and it’s done. Yeah, it’s over. That’s sex. Like, that’s what you get. And that’s what you get. From most things on TV. Or you get porn. Yep. Which, yes, if you’d like to have an orgasm where you squirt where there’s female ejaculate. Awesome if that is what you like every single time. Awesome, go for it. But that’s not what sex is. That’s not what pleasure true pleasure
Carly Someplace
is. And that’s not and that’s not everybody. It’s really just not everybody
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
like that. And that’s okay. Like and that’s like the beautiful thing you could teach yourself to squirt you can teach yourself to have a clitoral orgasm you can teach or elections I teach, you can learn how to you can learn how to have a cervical orgasm, you can learn how to have an internal intra vaginal wall orgasm, like you can learn all of those things. We all are capable of that. And if that’s the journey that you want to go on, like, let’s talk about it, and let’s get there. But this but like, the fact of like, slamming the penis into the vagina, like think about how excited guys get for their first time like hook. Yeah, right. Like we’re gonna do it right. And then the vulva owners over they’re like, freaking out like this is gonna hurt. Who How is that even something? That sounds like a good idea. Yeah, you know, but we don’t know how to talk about it. Because we aren’t told or we’re not taught we’re not provided with that support. That says it’s okay to know our
Carly Someplace
body, your body. Yeah. It’s yeah, it’s not. It’s such a taboo topic, which it shouldn’t be it we we literally all have bodies, every single one of us. If you’re listening to this, you own a body.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
I know. And it’s not a it’s not a I don’t know. It’s not a religious thing. It’s not a class thing. It’s not it’s just a body. Like it’s a body and those parts are you there for a reason. You we have a clitoris for a reason. Turns out we’re pretty lucky to have one. Exactly. And it’s just like when I show people what a clitoris looks like. They’re like what they think it’s like the little tiny ball, right? Yeah, pretty much it looks just like what a penis does on the inside. The only difference actually the only difference is the penis has a longer shaft. Yeah, that’s it. On the inside. It looks the exact same. Just the penis has a longer shaft.
Carly Someplace
That’s my buddy. I said that’s mind blowing.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Yeah, it had like it and once and they’re all made up. We call them different things because they’re in different types of bodies, but also we call them different things. Like guys have a prostate, we don’t say we have prostate, but female ejaculate? Yep. is essentially what the prostate gland is doing in the male. Right? And okay, well, so when you think about that, because this is just like a fun fact. This doesn’t necessarily have to do with painless sex. But since we’re mentioning female ejaculate, you know how like, there’s a lot of stuff like oh, it’s P bla bla bla, first of all, like, it’s not p. It’s not. And the reason why men don’t pee when they ejaculate is the same reason females don’t pee when they ejaculate. There’s a stop. There’s a step that prevents. That’s why it’s like hard to pee after sex sometimes. Right? Because your body has like that stop. So like the bladder can empty. You know to me. Anyways, that’s that’s a sign that’s a TN
Carly Someplace
like, No, I like that. I like that fun fact. Yeah. So.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Yeah, so like, it’s, you know, even paying attention to those little things like, Hmm, if I pee after sex don’t have to sit there for a little bit. Sometimes. Yeah. Because you’re like, Oh, crap. Like, my body is still like, I haven’t like given it enough time to like, calm down. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, it’s the same thing. That’s why men don’t pee when they ejaculate. Because their body naturally stops it. And ours does the same. Yeah, what? So cool.
Carly Someplace
It’s so cool. It’s such an bodies are so fascinating. And it’s so amazing. And again, that’s why I’m like, we need to learn more about that. We do we really need to, like, it shouldn’t require you going to school and becoming a doctor to learn these things about your body. It really shouldn’t.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Exactly, exactly. And you
Carly Someplace
should just this knowledge should just exist for all of us. And not in medical books. Not in and you know, anything. I think that it’s, it is it’s so important. And it’s so important.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Yeah. I mean, I think that the It’s like learning like to keep going back to anatomy like It’s like learning anatomy of anything, right? Like well, you learn like your arms and your legs and your wrist like you learn all those body parts. And that’s like the medical terms right or like the quote meta called terms like you don’t, we don’t learn that what your humerus and your OMA is right? Unless you’re like going further into anatomy, right? And so we don’t have to know what every single muscle of the pelvic floor is called. But we should know that there’s a pelvic floor. And we should know that there’s like muscles inside of our pelvis that like, kind of holds everything up there. Pretty important, right? Yeah, arguably, the pelvic floor and the diaphragm are the most important muscles in your entire body. Yeah, but we don’t learn about we learned about the diaphragm kind of, but we don’t learn about the pelvic floor. And, you know, once we know the anatomy, then that’s where like, the beauty like to go back to like learning like English language because, or any language, right? The beauty of the language comes, I would argue that maybe English isn’t like the most beautiful language, right? When you think of like the Romance languages, but
Carly Someplace
Italian, French Spanish, like once you get into
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
like, the poetry of language, that’s where it gets beautiful. And so if you have the parts, then you get to know your language and your poetry in your body. And that’s why it’s individually beautiful for each person. Yes, yeah. I
Carly Someplace
love that. I love that analogy.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
So weird, right? Who wants to go to English one on one now?
Carly Someplace
It’s so true, though. I think that I mean, especially like, I mean, coming into my 30s, I learned a lot more. I’ve learned a lot more in the last five years about my body than I did the previous 20 years before that, like, that’s, that’s pretty much where I’m at. And because at this point, I’m not afraid to ask questions. And I’m not afraid to have conversations. And I think that, and I mean, if this podcast can be anything, if this is a voice for anybody who’s afraid to ask questions, and do these things, like that’s, you know, I mean, part of why I wanted to talk to you, like, let’s talk about these taboo subjects, around sex, and like, you have that knowledge, because you did go to school, and you did become a doctor, and you did, you know, do all of these things, which is amazing. And now to have a platform to tell people like, hey, this isn’t normal. And we should be talking about these things, is huge. And I look at things like that. And I look at how, how much I’ve learned in the last five years. And I mean, really, the basis of this podcast is to share that we’re all different, that every single body is different, and every single body is deserving of being here. And in conversations that, you know, obviously, I’ve had not only do does everybody deserve to be here, and everybody deserves to have its place. Everybody deserves to feel pleasure and not be in pain as well. Like there’s there’s that aspect of it. And maybe that’s a more unspoken part of what I say on the podcast, but like, everybody deserves to have good experiences, feel happiness, feel love, feel pleasure, all of these things. Yes, that comes with the counter side of like, heartbreak, pain, etc. Like, we have all of these emotions that we run through. But we all are deserving of these things. And our bodies are set up to give us these things, but we don’t know how they work.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Yes. And you know, like, you just said, like, yes, that comes along with like heartache. And you know, all of that, like we have all of these emotions. But the thing that happens when you know your body so well. Pleasure with pleasure, yes, but just like, in general, when you know your body, and you experience like hardship, or heartache or heartbreak or somebody like you know, breaks up with you and you weren’t expecting it right? Right, or cheats on you, whatever it is, if you know your body, and you know what feels good in your body, and you know how you feel safe. You don’t veer from your path, as far as I know, you might be to the side and you might get pulled to the side a little bit. But it’s so much easier to get back onto your path. And know that whoever is supposed to be there beside you, their paths runs parallel to yours. It’s not intertwined. It’s parallel, and you get to stay on yours. But that doesn’t come if you don’t know your body. Yeah, you get thrown way off the cliff if you don’t know your body, because you’re going to be trying to like fit something else. Yeah, if you already know your body, you’re not going to budge.
Carly Someplace
No, it’s It’s such a body’s I mean, and I didn’t know that tissue holds trauma, but it makes so much. Yeah, it really makes so much sense. And I think that there’s such a an interesting correlation into that and and just who we are in our bodies, and and I see things of like people who make other people change their bodies, and then how that holds trauma. I had a client whose ex I forced them to get a weight loss surgery and, and discussing that with that client was was very deep and emotional and traumatic and being able to take photos and reclaim themselves in this new body that is theirs but also not there’s at the same time because of this control that came in I was like, That conversation will probably never leave me because see somebody else have their own control taken away is a lot. It’s a very, very crazy thing. And I just I mean, the amount of trauma stored in their body from that is a lot and and but then obviously I don’t want to be like boudoir can be healing, but it really can like you can yourself and experiencing things a different way. And I think that that’s, I think that in the same fell swoop sex can also be really healing. And it comes with if you’ve had a bad sexual experience or sexual trauma in any ways. Being with somebody and becoming comfortable with somebody is a really, really hard thing. But it’s healing.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Yeah, I totally agree. So when you talk about, okay, so like tissue stored, or tissue stored in the body, and motion, and trauma in the body. It’s gonna stay until you give it a pathway to express itself. Yeah. And so that’s why sometimes when you do yoga, and you’re doing a lot of hip opening stuff, people will get emotional. Yeah, I think that’s one of the easiest examples that I know like, if you’ve ever done yoga, and you do a lot of hip opening, sometimes that can like bring up a motion, then you’re like, I’m gonna go out, I’m gonna start my period, who knows what’s going on? Right? It’s likely not that it’s likely that you’re moving that tissue around. So when you think about the work you do, Carly, this is like, what’s so awesome about it is it’s not necessarily you’re putting them through a yoga move, right. But you’re putting them in the position to choose themselves with each pose that they do. And with like, giving them it’s probably the first time that a lot of the women who work with you have really been able to feel seen by another human standing fully in themselves, even if they don’t realize that, that they’re really there. Ya know, but it’s, it’s probably the first time that their body has been like, wow, I get to be in this space. There’s another human existing in this space with me. But I’m not judged. And I get to be here, and I get to wear the fancy clothes and like, feel really beautiful physically.
Carly Someplace
And then I put them in awkward yoga positions. But I really do, I’m always like, I’m always like, Okay, this is this yoga pose, but modified.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Yeah. But it’s not just that, like physical beauty that they get to their body gets to push through that emotional expression. And that’s how the trauma moves out of the body, it has to have a place to go, and you provide it for them.
Carly Someplace
Right? And that it’s and I see, it is that is really cool. And I really enjoy understanding the like, actual, like science behind that, which is awesome. But I do I mean, I get a lot of people with emotion in it. And a lot of people who, you know, it’s it’s very boudoir is a very different experience for everybody, everybody. And I think because people are always like, Oh, what’s your favorite thing about your job? I’m like, it’s like a frickin drug. It is such a drug to watch. People have these self realizations and self just like, like self realizations and self revelations. And just like being like, Oh, that is me. And I do look like that. And now I feel more confident. And, and it’s crazy to watch it to watch people go through these motions and be like, wait, what? I mean, my most common question is, is that actually me? And it’s like, I’m like, did you see anybody else in here? It breaks my heart every time but it also like my automatic reaction is of course it’s you. That is you and to see and I’ve seen a lot of people move through a lot of trauma with boudoir. I’ve seen people absolutely just break down completely break down at seeing themselves in that way. I’ve seen people even break down during the shoot when I give them a glimpse at the back of the camera because again, and my motto when I’m shooting is feels awkward, but it looks good. I promise you it looks good. I promise you it looks good because again, I’m putting these people in weird awkward yoga point positions that really they’re modified. But I’m also like, okay, cool. You’re getting all this stuff. But in the same fell swoop you are also getting like you know, yes, let me make your butt look good. Let me give you these things that society expects of your body and let you see them as their as well. as having this experience that is just for you. And it’s super powerful and like, and that’s people are like, you know, so you love it. I’m like, Oh, I love it. I love watching that I love watching that transformation within people. And I’m sure that you get a lot of that as well. And that’s, I think probably the most rewarding part of it is getting to watch people take control and power in their own bodies is is. There’s nothing like it that I can’t I don’t have words to describe it. I don’t have words to describe it. But I think that, you know, if a first step for somebody is hearing that it’s not, you’re not supposed to be in pain when you’re having sex. I think that I mean, to round out that point of it is that’s why I wanted to talk about it. I mean, I of course, I’ve occasionally had like, oh, that didn’t feel nice type moment. But like, I haven’t really been in a position where it’s like, oh, this is extremely uncomfortable all the time, or multiple times like that is I can be lucky, I guess. But my brain was like, Is this supposed to hurt is it supposed to is it’s supposed to feel like this and not being taught all of those things is holding us back as a society but being told, so if you’re listening and this in your need permission to say, Maybe I should see somebody or maybe I should talk about this, this is your permission. And this is your, you know, eye opener that it’s not supposed to be like that and and that you can teach yourself things. And yes, we all have individual unique bodies, but that doesn’t mean that you need to be in pain for it.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Yeah, exactly. I think like what you said, like first step Yes. Is if you are having pain, knowing that it’s not normal. Yeah. And that in and of itself can I think well, hopefully, it helps you feel a little bit comforted? Yes. But like free? Yeah. To be like, okay, all right, cool. Like, I know, I don’t like this isn’t gonna be like, what it’s like for the rest of my life. And then like my my second piece of advice, is just to start like, if you feel comfortable with it, take a mirror and look at what you look like. Yeah, look at what your Volvo look at what the lips look like, move the lips. And if you’re comfortable with it, the next step would be like, seeing what you look like during different parts of arousal. Right. So like, at rest, and then like, if you’re like use clitoral stimulation, or however you want to stimulate yourself and then look at your anatomy then and notice how it changes. Just if there’s any differences or if like, touch feels different to you then if you like different things during that. And you can go all the way through to orgasm, if you want to notice what your tissue looks like then. And just start there. But if that seems like too much, that’s okay. Just know that it’s not normal to have pain. And ask, like, send me a message. Like, it doesn’t have to be a big thing. You don’t have to tell anybody about it. If you don’t want to, you don’t have to tell your partner about it right away if you don’t want to. But ask someone tell someone find help somewhere, you know, and if, if you want to see somebody in person, you know, obviously, I’m in the Denver area. So I will help you find somebody. Right? If you don’t know where to go, you know, if you want to see somebody in person like you, you, you just don’t have to live like that. And it breaks my heart to know that so many women have lived like that for years. Yeah,
Carly Someplace
it breaks my heart too. Because, again, we’re all deserving of pleasure. Truly, truly, truly, we are all deserving of pleasure in multitude of ways. But like we’re all deserving of pleasure and sex shouldn’t be painful, because for the most part, most of us are doing it. And obviously, that ebbs and flows with everybody’s lives and bodies and where you are in life, and what seasons you’re in, and excetera, etc, etc. But like, for the most part, the majority of the population is having sex and the and the majority of the population doesn’t know that it shouldn’t be painful. And that that’s crazy. Yep, exactly. They’re crazy. Yeah. So I generally ask, and I know, I obviously asked them to you last time, my interview questions that I do. So I’m trying to see if there’s like a way I can like, if we can specifically bring them back into this, but I so I obviously have asked you, you know, like when did you come into being comfortable with your own body and having that journey? And I think so let’s flip that specifically for this conversation. When did you become a lot more comfortable in your sexual self of like, knowing and giving your body permission and giving these different things went like what, what did that look like for you? And my second question being the resources for that, obviously, I’m gonna assume that go Going to school for studying all this had some of that to do with it. But yeah,
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
um, okay, so I was really fortunate in that my first partner, like first person for, for just like play but also first person for like penis and vagina penetration. It was actually a very, very good experience. And I don’t, I’ve often thought about, like calling him and thanking him because he didn’t know what the heck he was doing. I don’t know, like, I don’t know what made me feel. So I think probably just because I was like comfortable with him, really, I think is what it comes down to, is that I made sure that every time we were doing anything that I was taking care of, and I didn’t worry about what he thought, and I don’t I honestly, truthfully, I don’t know what that was, I think maybe it just comes down to like being comfortable with him. I’m not really sure. And then I had a partner who was complete opposite end of the spectrum. And there was pain involved with that, and shame and like disgust and all of that stuff. And so that kind of like knocked me like way off the charts. Right? And I feel like, yes, my education, but I think that the greatest resource was myself. Yeah. Um, and just starting a conversation with myself of being like, Hey, how are you feeling right now? It’s so simple. It can seem so simple. But like multiple times throughout the day, like what do you need? Do you need water? Probably should have some water? Do you need to step outside and like feel the sunshine like, it doesn’t have to be anything big and crazy. And in terms of like, pleasure, like sexual pleasure, I should say, knowing like, what touch my body needed. For my from myself first, was probably the best thing that I learned. But again, that was like all self exploration. Right? It wasn’t like my books teaching me to do that. It was the things that I was
Carly Someplace
teaching your nails and your books were giving you like, and that the anatomy of it?
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Yes, exactly. Yeah. But it wasn’t teaching me like what flows in my body feel good. You know? And that was all
Carly Someplace
important to say as well, that’s different for everybody.
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
Yes. 100%. And so like, when you think about like what I do for a living, it’s not my job to tell you like, Hey, do this and this and this, and this, and this. And this, I can give you suggestions and be pleasurable. Yeah. I can give you suggestions, I can help walk you through some things if you have questions on it. But my job is to be the guide to help you figure that out. I’m giving you the authority that you need to like, figure it out yourself. With the support of me being there. Right, that makes sense.
Carly Someplace
And oh, yeah, absolutely. You’re your guide, but you’re also an expert. In the in the anatomy side of it? Well, if we go back to the like, English version of it of like, the English language, you’re like, you’re an English teacher, you’re not writing their poetry. Poetry is different for every single person you’re giving them this is, you know, these are the things that make these things go. This is the the physicality in your body that changes these things. You have control over how you create it into what your body wants. Yeah. Which is cool. I like that I like that new title for you. And then my last question is, what advice would you give your, your younger self? And let’s talk about what advice would you give yourself your younger self sexually, and that younger self can be last year that younger self can be, you know, middle school, or anytime?
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
I think the biggest thing, I’m like, looking at my younger self with that first partner, right? I really wish I would have kept that my the rest of my life, you know what I mean? Yeah. And when I had that partner who was really awful, in like treatment of me, I’m like, You know what I mean? I wish that somebody would have told me like what I actually said a little bit ago of like, Your path is here, and whoever is supposed to be with you on this, like their paths don’t intertwine with yours, they run parallel, right. But you are safe on your path. And as long as you stay true to who you are at your center, because it was one of those things where like, I knew it was wrong. I knew what he was doing was wrong. But I felt like there was punishment again. It was the shame right when there’s shaming anything And it’s really hard to like, come back from that. And I think if I would have known like, hey, no, no, no, it’s okay to stay on this path that that’s yours and to claim yours. And if they’re meant to be there, their path is gonna run parallel, but like, my path was going one way, and their path was going to make me take a right turn. Yeah, like 90 degree turn, as getting as far away from me as I could have gotten. Yeah. And so I just I wish I knew that. I wish I believed that I wish that I believed that I was worthy of that.
Carly Someplace
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Which is so important. Yeah. So important. Yeah. Okay, Ashley, where can people find you on Instagram to reach out to you if they want to, if they, you know, have questions, or if they are having pain during sex and possibly need a resource, obviously, the podcast spans more than just locally. So if you are in Denver, obviously, you yourself are a resource there. But I know that you have a network of, you know, trusted experts that you have, and that you can find and help people with in different areas for being
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
it. Yeah, for sure. And I don’t like I don’t ever have a problem with that, because I feel like we just have to help each other. You know, I’m absolutely so on Instagram. It’s at Ashley D. P. T. Or you can go to Dr. Ashley zimmerman.com. And there’s a way to get a hold of me on there.
Carly Someplace
Perfect. I love all of that. And I love that. And I will I’ll encourage anybody listening that if you do have questions, or if you do want to reach out to Ashley, she’s lovely. She’s lovely. And she’s nice. She’s she’s not scary. All I promise. As I hope you can understand from this conversation and past lives we’ve had, as well as I’m sure future ones that we’re gonna have. So yeah, Ashley, Thank you always for coming on and taking us in. It’s been the best. So
Dr. Ashley Zimmerman
thank you. Yep.
Carly Someplace
Thanks so much for listening to some place for everybody. If you love this episode, would you mind leaving me a review in your favorite podcast app and subscribe to the show. If you’re looking for a community to live on you and support you and your self love Journey, come join our all gender Facebook group someplace for everybody which can be found in the show notes at someplace for everybody.com Until we meet again, be kind to yourself.
